NAPgA Member Poll

[Taffy]

Are you a NAPgA member? Please vote in the above poll.

[Taffy]

This poll has had 40 views and only 9 people have voted! If you aren't a member of NAPgA I'd be interested in knowing why.

[Dave-Trinity-Farms]

I dont have any problem with voting or saying Im not a member. Granted, as early as tomorrow that will change. For me its 90% a matter of inconvenience and 10% just pure laziness I have already mentioned that if you want someone to pay money into anything they dont actually need, the payment process has got to be as easy as possible. Currently the 2 available options are not adequate. I know the diehards are going to bah! at that but thats because they have the WANT to join. But most people dont see a need or have a want to join a group they cant comprehend can benefit them. Most will not show up at the rendezvous either. They are content to just enjoy their goats in their own fashion, in their own locale areas. They also cant foresee the purposed forest closures effecting them either. I know for me, they wont effect my current packing (what little of it I get to do of it) as I dont plan to now or in any foreseeable future go packing into the purposed closure areas. Getting away to enjoy a few days at the rendies is the most I will get out in any given year. Running a farm eliminates anything that I cant do in the 12 hour window I have between chore times. For the rendy, Ill pay my daughter to take care of my chore load while I am gone as Tracy can not do her chores, my chores and work all at the same time. So if they do end up closing off the purposes areas, my packing habits would not be directly effected. BUT I am not naive. I fully know and understand this could end up on my door step in an avalanche of bureaucratic stupidity. So I will help how I can. Will I donate? If I have extra money sure. But with a $12,000 hay bill every year, extra money doesnt come in that often. In the same instance, I also understand the need for NAPgA and the good it does for each and every pack goat owner. But again, with its current make up, NAPgA doesnt effect most peoples pack goat use. It doesnt effect mine. I brought this side of it up to someone and they replied with. "What about your prospect sales. If NAPgA were not there and the closures in place, you would lose sales." Absolutely I would. NAPgA is the spear head of the pack goating spear . But I dont sell prospects for the money. I actually lose money raising prospects vs. selling butcher kids. I sell 3 month old, tame, bottle fed (milk replacer as well), hay and grain fed, lightly trained prospects at $150. I can sell week old buck kids at $50 all day long. Month old buck kids at $80-$100. 3 month old buck kids at $125+. And have no time or energy into them as they would be dam raised. I could then focus all that extra time and effort on the real money makers, the doe kids.

So having insight into the importance of NAPgA's and what it does for all of us is the WHY I will get my membership and hopefully be able to donate some $$ for legal fees. But the average Joe pack goater doesnt have that insight. So I dont think its right to pose the question of why arent they members. Instead Id like to see a "This is the benefits for all pack goat owners" post. Better to show someone what they are missing then to rib them for not being a member.

[Taffy]

Dave, you raise some very good points.

I did not post my question of why someone doesn't belong to NApGA to offend. I asked because I wanted to know.

I agree the majority of us will never do extreme packing in the wilderness areas or even travel outside our local areas to hike with our goats.

The issue I see here is the governmental agencies usurping our rights to enjoy public lands in a manner that has little to no impact on the lands and the wildlife. Big Horn Sheep mean big money to the agencies. The amount of money brought in for the few permits issued each year is amazing.

NAPgA is the only packgoat organization. When a governmental agency asks how many members NAPgA represents it's hard to make a case for packgoating when there are only about 50 members. They scoff at numbers like that. Even if we don't leave our areas to go packing we can help in the fight by being a member of NAPgA so when asked how many packgoating enthusiasts NAPgA represents the number can be high so they understand it is a viable use of the national forests, wilderness areas and public lands that we, as citizens of the US, own.

As a hay farmer I understand how tied to the farm you are. Our first cutting of hay is on the ground right now and we won't have any time off until 5th cutting is in the stack in October. I'm glad your daughter is able to take over for you so you can come to the Rendy.

I didn't realize there was such a big market for wethers in our area or that you lose money raising packgoats. That doesn't sound like a sustainable business. I have seen your goats and your operation. It and they are very impressive. I hope you continue to offer high quality packgoat kids for many years to come.

NAPgA is the only organization representing packgoaters and it needs to fill the needs of those who enjoy this sport - whether they are extreme packers or day hikers.

NAPgA is fighting on our behalf (and future generations of goatpackers) to keep lands open for all goatpackers. I believe we should support NAPgA by being members and, if possible, donating to the cause.

Time to get off my soapbox.

But most people don't see a need or have a want to join a group they cant comprehend can benefit them. Most will not show up at the rendezvous either. They are content to just enjoy their goats in their own fashion, in their own locale areas. They also cant foresee the purposed forest closures effecting them either. I know for me, they wont effect my current packing (what little of it I get to do of it) as I dont plan to now or in any foreseeable future go packing into the purposed closure areas. Getting away to enjoy a few days at the Rendies is the most I will get out in any given year. Running a farm eliminates anything that I cant do in the 12 hour window I have between chore times. For the rendy, Ill pay my daughter to take care of my chore load while I am gone as Tracy can not do her chores, my chores and work all at the same time. So if they do end up closing off the purposes areas, my packing habits would not be directly effected. BUT I am not naive. I fully know and understand this could end up on my door step in an avalanche of bureaucratic stupidity. So I will help how I can. Will I donate? If I have extra money sure. But with a $12,000 hay bill every year, extra money doesnt come in that often. In the same instance, I also understand the need for NAPgA and the good it does for each and every pack goat owner. But again, with its current make up, NAPgA doesnt effect most peoples pack goat use. It doesnt effect mine. I brought this side of it up to someone and they replied with. "What about your prospect sales. If NAPgA were not there and the closures in place, you would lose sales." Absolutely I would. NAPgA is the spear head of the pack goating spear . But I dont sell prospects for the money. I actually lose money raising prospects vs. selling butcher kids. I sell 3 month old, tame, bottle fed (milk replacer as well), hay and grain fed, lightly trained prospects at $150. I can sell week old buck kids at $50 all day long. Month old buck kids at $80-$100. 3 month old buck kids at $125+. And have no time or energy into them as they would be dam raised. I could then focus all that extra time and effort on the real money makers, the doe kids.

So having insight into the importance of NAPgA's and what it does for all of us is the WHY I will get my membership and hopefully be able to donate some $$ for legal fees. But the average Joe pack goater doesnt have that insight. So I dont think its right to pose the question of why arent they members. Instead Id like to see a "This is the benefits for all pack goat owners" post. Better to show someone what they are missing then to rib them for not being a member.

[Nanno]

Most will not show up at the rendezvous either.

Yeah, that would be me! Too far for me during Saddle Club season and much too far for Cuzco at his time of life. I couldn't leave him home!

[Dave-Trinity-Farms]

Sorry Taffy, I didnt mean to imply that you posed the question just to rib people. I was just speaking on my experiences and hoping to give the enthused a little word of caution. I think Taffy poses a GREAT question.

"Why are you not a member?"

This is a perfect threat to shed insight into what we and NAPgA can do, to help people get excited (like TOU about being a member of the North American Pack goat Assoc. So I 100% back and agree with the question, why?
As I have said, its more about the inconvenience of it. But for some, maybe its the money. Sure its just $20.00, but in my case, I am 4,500+ miles on my last oil change. So when I look at how I need to spend my money, the oil change is going to win out vs joining. The oil change cant wait, but the membership can.

I have already mentioned Id like to see an easier payment method on the website. But maybe some incentives would go along a long way. Maybe something like a 5% or 10% discount at Northwest Pack Goats or other venders? How about maybe applying those to different levels of membership with the higher level getting a "gift" for it. 20 a year for junior, 50 a year for senior with a "free" shirt which they actually buy with the extra 30.00 and a little extra money for group. There is a lot of information on the NAPgA website but not nothing to push anyone to join. There are a ton of things that could be done (the above 2 were just off the top of my head as I was typing) to get people interested and excited about joining NAPgA.

And although I dont make any extra money on the prospects, I do prosper in that when one of these little boys leaves now, instead of going to the dinner table, they are going to in rich peoples lives. I am providing 10, 12 or even 15 years of happiness for not only the person but for the goat as well. There is no possible price tag that could be put on that

LOL Nanno, thats not the kinda not showing up I was talking about. Not showing up for distance is perfectly ok regardless of who you are. Another few miles and I myself might of decided na. No, I was talking about the people who just are not interested or are not set up to leave on such a trip or dont even know.

Though at some point we are going to have to let the diva's (Cuzcu and Legion) meet I for one cant wait!