Chat
igoat, thank you very much for contributing to this discussion and to our cause. You obviously know a whole lot about these issues and the "lingo" of the Forest Service.
Please tell us a little about yourself. Where are you located? How many packgoats do you own? Do you have past experience with the Forest Service?
Charlie Jennings
www.bearriveroutfitters.com
Deweyville, Utah
Excellent reply! NAPgA has discussed at length about the arbitrary and capricious nature of the claims of the Forest Service and the Game & Fish in regards to the domestic goats and their interaction with BHS.
Yes, our Attorney is "on top" of the current issues. Larry and myself communicate with him on a weekly basis and keep him informed as to what is going on throughout the western U.S. regarding closures to packgoats. Not only do we feel that Andy Irvine is very competent on these issues, BUT he is also passionate about our cause and has already donated a significant amount of his time "pro-bono".
The area of the Fitzpatrick Wilderness area in the Shoshone National Forest that was subjected to the temporary closure over a year ago is where the Whiskey Mountain Bighorn Sheep ranges. We had proposed a "corridor" through this area where we would stay on the trail and hike through this area quickly, NOT spending the night, and get to the other side and camp for the night. We thought it was a pretty logical plan, but was met with complete opposition.
It was mentioned about the chances of BHS interacting with cattle...I have a photo of a BHS sharing a water trough with a cow, I'll have to see if I can find it!
Please tell us a little about yourself. Where are you located? How many packgoats do you own? Do you have past experience with the Forest Service?
Charlie Jennings
www.bearriveroutfitters.com
Deweyville, Utah
(04-18-2014, 09:15 AM)igoat Wrote: When it comes to the legal matter though, if you are hearing comments like the "one in a million chance" being too great, I hope you are informing Larry to bring that to NAPgA's attorney Mr. Irvine. Under NEPA governmental agencies aren't supposed to work on those kind of absolutes, and need to enact regulations that take into consideration not only the environmental impact but also the economical or social impacts as well. It should also be pointed out that there is probably a better than a 1 in a million chance that a BHS Ram on a foray would wander down onto private property and come into contact with a domestic sheep herd, and a far better that a million to one chance that a BHS would get hit by a car. But, neither of those instances can legally be mitigated by the forest plan because it would put an undo burden on the public at large, and the benefit to the BHS would be outweighed by other human concerns.
So, I hope everyone here is contributing to the legal fund so that we can afford to keep Mr. Irvine in this fight, because if the Shoshone disregards the Objections he just filed, then our next recourse is to fight the FS in open court for making their "arbitrary and capricious" regulations, and that will likely cost upwards of $100k in legal fees. (which we might be able to get back if we win and the judge finds that the error was egregious enough).
Excellent reply! NAPgA has discussed at length about the arbitrary and capricious nature of the claims of the Forest Service and the Game & Fish in regards to the domestic goats and their interaction with BHS.
Yes, our Attorney is "on top" of the current issues. Larry and myself communicate with him on a weekly basis and keep him informed as to what is going on throughout the western U.S. regarding closures to packgoats. Not only do we feel that Andy Irvine is very competent on these issues, BUT he is also passionate about our cause and has already donated a significant amount of his time "pro-bono".
The area of the Fitzpatrick Wilderness area in the Shoshone National Forest that was subjected to the temporary closure over a year ago is where the Whiskey Mountain Bighorn Sheep ranges. We had proposed a "corridor" through this area where we would stay on the trail and hike through this area quickly, NOT spending the night, and get to the other side and camp for the night. We thought it was a pretty logical plan, but was met with complete opposition.
It was mentioned about the chances of BHS interacting with cattle...I have a photo of a BHS sharing a water trough with a cow, I'll have to see if I can find it!