Sick Goat

[Nanno]

I'm so glad she's doing better!!!

[Dave-Trinity-Farms]

Just going to add some blurbs from the cydectin (CATTLE POUR ON) analysis read out.

Mode of Action

Moxidectin is an endectocide in the milbemycin chemical class which shares the distinctive mode of action characteristic of macrocyclic lactones. CYDECTIN (moxidectin) Pour-On is specially formulated to allow moxidectin to be absorbed through the skin and distributed internally to the areas of the body affected by endo- and/or ectoparasitism. Moxidectin binds selectively and with high affinity to glutamate-gated chloride ion channels which are critical to the function of invertebrate nerve and muscle cells. This interferes with neurotransmission resulting in paralysis and elimination of the parasite.

Yes, pour ons are used orally all the time. But this is, and I quote "specially forumulated to allow moxidectin to be absorbed through the skin"

Dosage

CYDECTIN (moxidectin) Pour-On is a ready-to-use topical formulation intended for direct application to the hair and skin in a narrow strip extending along the top of the back from the withers to the tailhead (see Figure 1). Due to the angular topline characteristic of most dairy breeds, it is recommended that all pour-on products be applied slowly to dairy cows. Apply to healthy skin avoiding any mange scabs, skin lesions, mud or manure. Treated cattle can be easily recognized by the characteristic purple color, which will remain for a short period of time after treatment. The recommended rate of administration is 1 mL for each 22 lb (10 kg) body weight which provides 0.5 mg moxidectin for each 2.2 lb (0.5 mg/kg) body weight.

Precautions

For external use only. Do not apply to areas of skin with mange scabs, skin lesions, mud or manure. Cydectin Pour-On is not recommended for use in species other than cattle. This product has been formulated specifically for topical use in cattle and should not be used in other animal species or by other routes of administration as adverse reactions may occur. Cydectin Pour-On is effective against the migrating stage of cattle grubs (Hypoderma larvae). Treatment with Cydectin Pour-On during the period when grubs are migrating through vital areas may cause undesirable host-parasite reactions. Killing H. lineatum when they are located in peri-esophageal tissues may cause bloat. Killing H. bovis when they are in the vertebral canal may cause staggering or hindlimb paralysis. Cattle should be treated as soon as possible after heel fly (warble fly) season to avoid this potential problem. Cattle treated with Cydectin Pour-On at the end of fly season can be re-treated during the winter without danger of grub-related reactions. Consult your veterinarian for more information regarding these secondary grub reactions and the correct time to treat with Cydectin Pour-On.

Dwite spoke of the pour on having more of Moxidectin and indeed he was right in that the bottle contains more of it. Not the does. The break down is as follows: The amount of moxidectin the animal gets at recommended cattle does (which still needs to be increased across the board on all 3 types) per 110 lbs is 1ml for the injectable, 5ml for the pour on and 10ml for the drench. Which means the injectable is the strongest forum with the pour on being 5x diluted and the drench being 10 times diluted. But in the end, each method delivers the same amount of moxidectin per lb because of the recommended dosing. The issue then comes in to how each is designed to be administered and the inactive ingredients. Costs reflect this with the injectable being the cheapest until you factor in needles and syringes which puts it on par with the pour on. So we can now focus on the Pour On and the Drench. But here is the problem with that. There is no cattle doesage for the sheep drench but as with everything else if there were, it would equal out how much each animal got of Moxidectin.

Now here is where it gets interesting. As mentioned goats need 2-4 times the cattle dosage because goats metabolize faster then cattle and have a much more active rumin. I challenge anyone to do a search for goat vs cattle doses. On every forum and every page of long standing knowledgeable goat people and websites you will see, dosages are indeed increased. Call up a livestock vet who knows goats and they will tell you the same thing. This is the real life trial and error I spoke of. But the key difference (after some research) as mentioned above is how each method is specifically designed to be used. Dwite says his source of knowledge says to use the pour on. Well the pour on, the carrier in it, is kerosene based. NO, i dont not mean they use kerosene but a chemical in the same family that is close to kerosene. Thus the smell. Just like Ivormecin is alcohol based. There is also a water resistant chemical in the pour on. This helps to keep the pour on in place long enough for the carrier to help the skin absorb the moxidectin. And finally, the purple dye. Which is simply meant to give a visual to the farmer which animal has been done. There is no research on this dye that I can find of yet but again, something else potentially not good to put into your goat. Now on the other hand, you have the drench which is designed to be taken orally. Designed to be gentler on the animals rumin. No harsh chemical carrier. No unknown dye. The only reason people use the pour on as an oral is the price. Its the cheapest way to go. That and it can actually burn the goats skin.

[Reckless]

Glad to here that she's better!

[sydneyjd]

Ok,Goobert is doing better,but she is not eating. She has no appetite for anything,even though her body needs it. She will eat a little grain,but we had to force some hay down her mouth for her to take it. What do i do? Her body is functioning properly again though.

[Nanno]

Have you given her any probiotics? She needs them to jump-start her rumen again after being sick.

Once she's had some probiotics, you could try alfalfa leaves or pellets to tempt her. If she'll eat grain, she might eat alfalfa pellets. Have you tried taking her out to fresh graze/browse? What's her favorite tree to snack on? You could try cutting a branch and see if she's interested.

[sydneyjd]

Whats a probiotic? What would be a good one to give her? I have her in a pasture,but she doesn't want to eat anything,not even trees. I haven't tried alfalfa pellets yet,but will right now.

[Nanno]

Your feed store should carry probiotics made for goats, but some folks use yogurt with live cultures. I don't think yogurt is quite as good, but it's better than nothing. Probiotics are the good bacteria that make the rumen work. When your goat gets sick, stressed, or is on medication, the rumen can become full of the wrong bacteria. Antibiotics can kill not only bad bacteria, but the good bacteria as well. When you give your goat probiotics, you're replacing the good bacteria so the rumen can begin to function again.

[sydneyjd]

Ok,I have some yogurt,i will try to give her some. Thanks Nanno!!

---

Yay,she took it. We will see what it does. It says it has active cultures.
Oh,and as you can see,we didn't sell her.

[sydneyjd]

Lat night Goobert was doing great. This morning she was not feeling very good,and at 11:00 AM She died.

[deschutes dawn]

Sydney, so sorry. I hope all the others in your herd are doing well.